we're on a mission from god

wendy so i got that going darling

looks like i picked the wrong way to

quit sniffing blue light

of my life we enjoy your films

[Music]

welcome to vintage video where we're

re-watching the 80s so you don't have to

we'll be reviewing every major film

release of the 1980s in real time

i'm patrick o'reilly i'm jesse bayless

and i'm richard wells and today marks

the 40th anniversary of the release of a

small circle of friends on march 12

1980 it was written by ezra sax directed

by rob cohen and released by united

artists

the title is a reference to a phil oakes

song he was a protest singer who killed

himself four years before this movie

came out

the premise would more accurately

suggest the title a small triangle of

friends

as it deals primarily with three

characters

when the original director john cordy

stepped away united artist was reluctant

to allow

rob cohen to pick up the reigns and

demanded that he find a backup

in the event he was fired from the film

but backup director arthur hiller was

never called to action

they finished the film with the first

director and apparently we're happy with

what they got

the score for the film was composed by

jim steinman and i hope you like it

because

you hear it constantly and it was

probably less distracting at the time

but because diamond later basically

reused the theme of this film as the

chorus for bonnie tyler's total eclipse

of the heart

i couldn't stop singing it over the

entire movie like there was a whole part

of it there was later and i was like

is that totally clips yeah

i kept singing it and i was like why are

they playing this song in the 60s

right and jess is like well it's it's

not trying to be that song and i was

like it sounds like it's

just like it's just the score and then

she looked it up and she's like

same composer same guy wrote both so he

just wrote it for this and then later

used it as a hit song but he's

apparently the composer for meatloaf

right yeah which i which i'm like i

didn't i didn't realize that the same

composer

wrote total eclipse of the heart as well

as like i would do anything yeah but

yeah cause those songs always reminded

me of each other and i never realized

why

just their massive mid 80s power balance

too

um but yeah i couldn't stop singing at

the whole second half of the movie

um the production was kicked off the

harvard campus during

during the filming uh and so a riot

scene had to be recorded at

bridgewater state college um but they

did sneak back under the harvard campus

for

whatever they could shoot discreetly

were they kicked off

because of the portrayal of the riot i

think so

okay um which you looked up and was a

real thing yeah oh yeah there was

actually a riot at harvard square yeah

yeah and they would have only been 11

years prior so maybe they were still a

little

shy about it yeah we start in quote

present day uh as

nick baxter sees jessica bloom getting

into a cab

and chases her down on his bike

eventually crashing into it

to get her attention setting the

complete wrong tone for this movie

well also the we we decided that the

present day thing was a really

awkward way to like note the year that

this is taking place

because you assume no one's gonna watch

it a day after nineteen yeah

yes it's not like they weren't expecting

this to last i don't know because then

shortly later they're like

now it's 1967.

you know and and so like then they have

the they have the

the date come up and you're in you're

like well either you use

present day and then 13 years earlier

or you say 1980 and then 1967 right like

but but

mixing the two feels really weird yep

because now i have to do

math uh

so now we're back in 1967 on the harvard

campus as

nick's mother is dropping him off he's a

pre-med student

getting ready to register for his

classes and inside the registration

building

leonardo da vinci enters pretending to

be blind

excuse me blind excuse me

excuse me excuse me blind the first of

so many reasons in this film

to hate this guy yeah he's quirky and

fun

he's using a disability to get ahead of

everybody else's life

i honestly wonder though if it's if it's

just of the time period that at the time

people watching this would have been

like oh that's kind of funny like that's

silly that he's doing that

or if it was people just going clearly

as offensive i don't know

screw this guy this guy's a jerk see if

this was like animal house

and they were pulling some kind of stunt

yeah it's like okay maybe i'll let it

let it slide but that's again the wrong

tone for this movie oh yeah this isn't

goofy

like those kinds of movies but yeah so

he he pulls that off to get to the front

and then he says i shouldn't have to

take pe right

basically because he's blind she's like

well no you shouldn't have to i don't

see

and then he said i'd also like to sign

up for creative photography

and she's like well you can't do that

your eyes don't work

like she's so taken aback at the

suggestion it's like i would have just

been like whatever it's not my job to

keep blind people out of creative

photography

and when she's like well but but you're

but how can you

and then he's like i know i'm blind but

you can't tell a blind person not to do

this and

it starts like lecturing on behalf of

the disabled on its way out of the

building

as he's like folding up the cane that he

was using to

guide himself and takes off his glasses

shouting about all these

famous artists with disabilities and the

whole room

breaks into applause like it's a dumb

fake story someone made up

well he also ends it with like you know

and so-and-so did this and so-and-so did

that and why can't

leonardo da vinci and i was so confused

at this point because i didn't realize

that that was his name i'm like

yeah later on davinci did some good

things like i'm confused

why wouldn't leonardo da vinci be

allowed in a photography classroom

it didn't exist yet they uh they move

into the dorms

where we're introduced to a nerdy texan

roommate of leonardo da vinci's who

who's showing off

the knots that he tied as an eagle scout

which he has framed on the wall in their

room

this character goes nowhere so it's yeah

there's no one would bother being

introduced to just go ahead and forget

him he's not going to come back

uh at night leo is almost caught with a

girl that

he had snuck into the dorms uh well uh

i wanted to say something about that

scene because there's a lot of dialogue

that this had me cracking up for some

reason

in which scene the the scene where he's

meeting haddocks oh okay

um because he's talking about his

roommate he's like oh his name is

leonardo da vinci can you believe that

so he's going to write for the new york

times yeah yeah the last line

he says he's going to write for the new

york times someday and then nick goes

jesus look like he's horrified that's

so shocking horrified by the prospect of

this guy writing for the new york times

like what a mediocre goal for someone

who

is at harvard right now like okay yeah

you're right for the new york times

there's a lot of harvard

graduates for the new york times it was

just a really great line read and i

don't know what it was supposed to mean

yeah i think that might be like this

seems like a several times in this film

where they're

implying that being liberal back then

would be

shocking and i think that might be one

of those kind of moments

but nick of all people seems like the

one that's the least bothered by it he's

like telling people oh no go ahead and

date them or whatever

but yeah so leo brings a girl to the

dorms and he's

trying to kick her out in the middle of

the night when they knock something

over and call the attention of a guard

in the dorm house

so he runs across the hall to

the co-ed bathrooms and shoves her into

a shower stall

where nick is taking a shower at three

o'clock in the morning

and then he goes to pee at the urinal

and when the guy whose attention they

caught

walks into the room he's just like oh

sometimes you just really gotta go pee

get out of here leave me alone

now he's like wait a minute who's in the

shower then and then nick's like i'm

trying to take a

3am shower in peace he's like oh geez

sorry guys i guess i'll just go back

downstairs

don't mind me it's like like

it just seemed like a totally pointless

scene and when leo goes to retrieve his

girlfriend from the shower she's like

scrubbing nick's back and doesn't want

to get out of the shower she's like no

no this is great

and it's basically setting up what's

gonna happen over the course of his life

which is that

that leo's gonna screw things up with a

girl and then shove her on

nick yeah and then they're gonna like

make better

so we get uh we get this pointless scene

of

nick and leo showing off how gymnastic

they are

and uh they're just like swinging around

on range no payoff later

there's there's a tiny inkling of a

payoff but

it's it's really there's not there's not

a good reason there's no good reason for

them both to be

gymnastics that's true there's only

there's only reason to show

that leo is physically capable of doing

things

i have a sneaky feeling that they just

are like

these guys are actual like gymnasts

let's let's use that

yeah exactly but yeah so they both get

to show off their gym skills and it's

clearly them doing the stuff too which

is why

i'm i'm sure it is just an instance of

the actors like can we get a shot of me

swinging around on these rings i'm

really good at it

we need to build up some character

because uh this is character right

um nick gets a job at a book shop with a

psychic

um later nick talks to

haddocks about his socialist girlfriend

her jewish socialist girlfriend he

was like he's like i don't know if they

could handle me dating her

and she's jewish it's like oh boy you're

just really letting your parents down

yes like your texan family has to deal

with your jewish socialist girlfriend oh

they'll have to deal with more

later yeah but uh nick is just like well

if you love her then just go for it it

doesn't matter and this is the first

time anyone's telling addicts that in

his whole life so i guess he's just like

all right well whatever nobody else is

nobody's looking

i'll do what i want this is all nick's

fault we i should i need to preface this

nick is the cause of all of these we've

accused a lot of real-life actors of

murder here we're

accusing a character of murders later in

the film uh

leo and nick go to a bar where they

share their crappy dad stories

there's another gentleman in the bar

that's watching tv and sings

the the national anthem for almost no

reason maybe no reason well no

he's he's depressed that his son is been

called off door yeah um so he he's

that's why he's there drinking that's

why he's there drinking he's depressed

and he's

trying to show that he's proud of him

but also horribly upset that he's

probably gonna go and die

right but it's uh i don't know

it just feels like there's a lot of

stuff that's just kind of thrown in

for extra atmosphere that doesn't really

feed into the story

well enough what story

sure this is your favorite kind this is

a slice of life

it's your favorite i hate that kind of

movie

while they're talking about their dads

nick basically says that his dad like

he broke his arm once and he cried and

his dad was like don't cry and he's like

so i never cried again

it's like that's how easy it was that's

crazy i'm gonna tell my kid not to cry

leo meets and flirts with jess while

stealing books from a library

um he's unzipping his pants in and she's

leaning over to grab a book

on the opposite side of the shelf at

crotch level so at first you think this

is a completely different scene than it

is

but he's just tucking a report into his

pants and then he notices that she

noticed him

and he's like oh god this girl's going

to tell on me i hope she doesn't tell on

me

but instead of just putting the report

back and stealing it 20 minutes later

he goes out right alongside her in the

library and notices that she didn't

write him out

because she doesn't care she doesn't

care about because you just stole a book

from a library

right but he does say that the library

wouldn't let him check it out because

it's a government report

but it's like you can also just read it

here in the library that's what

the library is for is for reading the

books in it

the crimson shoots down the story that

leo is trying to pitch

and he gets really mad about it so he

goes and he gets nick

and they break into the crimson offices

after hours

with the most pointless use of this tool

like he's

they're trying to show that he's like oh

he knows how to do he's street wise and

he knows how to break into stuff

but he uses this tool completely wrong

and he breaks the window in a way that

it would have just made more sense to

throw a rock through it

yeah like because he's like this crazy

suction cup thing and you think like oh

he's gonna cut

and then pull the piece out he's trying

to score the glass

and then he tells nick to turn away and

he just

yanks on it and tears it and he tears it

out like diagonally out of the glasses

just shards hanging out which he has to

punch into the room i mean

it's not like he saved them any work

because he cut half of the pain

out so it's like you're gonna have to

replace the whole thing anyways you

might as well just punch it out yeah

and uh so they go in and they take this

story that leo wrote that

that the school paper wasn't going to

publish and they just put it in every

copy

of the paper and then they go home and

they go to sleep

and the next morning they wake up and

they're like oh my god that thing that

we did still happened

like they're acting like so surprised

that it worked

when all the their master plan was

putting two pieces of paper into another

folded piece of paper yeah

um i also love the scene when they run

into the cafeteria and everyone's

reading it

the sql the sweeping score comes in and

i feel like i feel like i feel like i'm

at hogwarts

harry just got a broom it does it does

feel like uh

like the music is very heavily saturated

here

and completely unnecessary and they're

like hugging each other like it's the

happiest day of their lives

when in reality what would happen is

because these two pages that they

slipped into the paper

are goldenrod for no reason compared to

the rest of it yeah they would have just

been

pulled out and unceremoniously thrown

away immediately

it's like oh someone put a bunch of

stuff in these is this is this supposed

to go out no

toss it um but for some reason

everyone's

not only are they reading the school

paper but they're reading these little

flyers that someone tucked into the

school paper

and we should mention that the article

is about

the man at the bar jimmy right uh who

was upset about his son going to war

which although it does affect these kids

i would be surprised if the entire

school was reading that article in the

cafeteria at the same time the way they

portray it here

leo has an eye patch for some reason

he got into he got into a fight a bar

fight yeah but we don't see the bar

fight and we don't get any injuries that

he gets drunk and gets in bar fights

like that doesn't happen in this movie

uh there's a protest outside of the

dean's office

uh with the pouring rain coming down

yeah and haddax

is is leading it and he has an

interesting line about

that it's it's too rainy for other

liberals like like they're not committed

to we're the extremists

yeah we're they're not committed to the

cause like we are

more foreshadowing right uh leo

uh tells does he tell two different

explanations for the eye patch because

he says one

one thing to one kid

when jesse asks about it he says

that he got into fighting yeah too

gruesome to talk about yeah it's like

it's like

you want to know how i got these scars

yeah conversation

he goes to a meeting in the dean's

office where he's explaining

some changes that are being made to the

school policies um

that are affecting a donut region

around the major cities and then

leo basically jumps in and says don't

you mean a bagel around these cities

because you're clearly trying to get

all the jewish students out of your

school so that you don't have to deal

with all these

jewish parents who are anti-war because

they're basically

like in this movie jewish equal

socialist equals anti-war

like they're they're conflating like all

three of these things are just by

definition

entangled and is harvard

pro war well they're

they're pro-military at the very least

because they

you know the rich families are

pro-military because that's what

protects their

their giant piles of gold right

i thought we'd just put those in vaults

and then

swim in them but see scrooge looks after

his own money

that's right that's why he's got all

those booby traps

harry is the guy who runs the bookstore

yeah

i kind of liked the scene just because

it was like i don't know what this is

leading up to

it's not it's

any of these scenes leading to this

movie isn't about anything

i mean it is supposed to be a slice of

life thing but there's all these scenes

that

act like they're playing into like some

major thing that's gonna happen later

but no one has to do gymnastics later in

the movie right and no one has to

do drugs later in the movie right you

could never pick a job at this bookstore

yeah and then and then nothing happens

with that again

but so harry this bookstore on her like

nick is receiving some packages and he

finds a bunch of like bongs and

like a bunch of pipes and he's like what

is going on here and he's like oh i'm

going to start a head shop it's going to

be the new big thing and then after that

is computers but

we don't have time to get into that

right now it's like 1967 like

yeah this guy wasn't really i don't i

don't think he was on top of computers

are going to be the next big thing

is is this supposed to be hilarious like

we in 1980 think it's really funny so

like

ha ha drugs were the future yeah

yeah it's like uh when kate winslet is

lugging around a picasso on the titanic

oh god not those finger paintings again

they certainly were a waste of money

the difference between cows taste and

art and mine is that i have some

they're fascinating like being inside a

dream or something

there's truth but no logic what's the

artist's name something picasso

something picasso it won't amount to a

thing get it

20 20. hindsight can you believe it that

he knew that drugs were going to be big

this fictional character we wrote

those drugs have never been big

especially

60s yeah definitely not

uh leo and jess come out of a screening

of the graduate

um and they both have different

interpretations yes of the

of the ending the same interpretations

that i think anybody has

so really not adding much to that either

they

yeah they they basically it's supposed

to be like a revelation of

the differences between those two

characters where she's a little bit more

cynical

and less like pie in the sky high hopes

and he's like

the romantic who is

overly optimistic but he gets really

angry yeah

so it's kind of um there's a bit of a

conflict there within him

on a news broadcast um in a on a crowded

tv

in the dorm building they're watching

johnson say that he's not going to run

for president again

and they all celebrate it we get another

glimpse of uh

haddocks's uh activism

when he uses one of his eagle scout

knots to tie a noose for

hanging johnson and effigy in the main

hall of the building leo

explains that his dad named him da vinci

when he was like when his dad first saw

him when he was a baby he was like

this kid's gonna do great things i'm

gonna name him leonardo da vinci

and and he has a last name too but he

dropped it

in high school because he was like what

is the quote better to be an

ass than a half-ass which i don't know

what that means and i'm not sure that

that's necessarily true either

but um he's definitely an ass and

it seems like a weird way to celebrate

your father than to be like

oh mom left and you're all i have so you

know what i'd like to not use your name

anymore dad

i'm just going to go by the mom that

left i thought

his mom left when he was a kid so he had

his dad and his dad was supportive

um but his mom disappeared she went with

some other guy

and they never came back um speaking of

his father

they go on a quick date to just some

random building

downtown it seems like yeah well inc or

something yeah but we don't

we and we don't realize at this point

that the guy who's letting him in

is his father right i i had a suspicion

that it was when we first come to this

building

but him and jess walk into this building

after hours and he walks up and talks to

the guy running the security desk

and they seem friendly and then he's

like all right come with me and they go

upstairs and they have like a romantic

dinner

on the roof of this building but he

doesn't introduce her to this guy that

he just spoke with but

unless he's just like an older friend of

his i was like okay that's going to be

his dad that just

lets him do whatever he wants but he

also seems like he's very chummy with

everybody including right right random

people so i could

just as easily see him this being a

stranger right but

we'll come to find out that you're

suspicious suspicion was correct right

but i'm curious how she made that leap

because i mean unless they had a

conversation later that we weren't privy

to or something well

it cuts to a year later so i'm sure they

must have had some kind of conversation

maybe yeah in uh one of her art classes

jesse

is getting lectured by a teacher who

says that the the typical like

revolution

fist in the air uh illustration is not

not dirty enough not angry enough to be

an effective it's too little it's too

middle class

yeah um and he's showing all these like

broken hands from guernica and it's like

yeah but this is just picasso that's

just how he draws hands

this is that's how he drew wealthy hands

i'm not very good with

hands but yeah and uh

and she's taking this very much to heart

that she's saying oh well you know what

revolution can start with good

iconography i'm gonna go back and fix

this and we're gonna

we're gonna change the whole revolution

by just that's the lesson she got i mean

i

realized that she came away from it

thinking i should do

art for the revolution but like

his whole his whole speech about like oh

the length of the fingers and the

evenness of it like it was so

so snobby obnoxious yeah that it was

just trying to find an excuse to

to to call this thing bad

you know i figured that that was all it

took to get her to be like

yeah that's a bunch of i'm

gonna go yeah she should have just been

like okay boomer and walked out of the

room

that seems to be the lesson she's taking

from this lecture

uh the guys bring her a mattress that

they found somewhere

like she needed a mattress she's been

sleeping on her hardwood floors

and they were like hey we found this

mattress and we got most of the blood

off

they don't say that but they did there's

hardly any blood left

they they bring it into her apartment

and lay it down

and then leo's like hey can you go in

the other room so we can have sex right

here on the floor

mm-hmm and and he's like oh like sure i

guess that's kind of weird

i guess we do that just want to watch

wait what yeah

but it's also like we found this

mattress on the ground first of all

second of all like you couldn't wait

five seconds for me to leave

naturally before you were like oh let's

look chris on this thing

well and then and she's very resistant

but he's like but you help me make the

bed

right right like what what else could

that have meant you put a sheet on this

thing

we must do it now it's the implication

yeah

we made our bed now let's sleep in it

but

uh she's not interested at the moment

and he keeps

being very forceful about it until she's

like all right well i'm out

see ya and he comes outside he's like i

don't understand her what's wrong with

that girl and nick's like

you weren't listening to her at all she

was trying to talk to you about an art

project and you were just saying you

wanted to have sex with her

he's like i listened it's like okay

what did she say then why did you seem

to not know what she said if you were

listening so well

then he gets mad at nick for siding with

her and this disagreement

later in the in the dorms haddocks is

like a full-on conspiracy nut

yeah he's complaining about everything

that happened over the summer and

the whole world's going crazy around him

he's got like the coke bottle glasses

and the like the

green fatigue jacket yeah and lieutenant

dan hair like down to his shoulder

and then we have uh green black is that

the name of the

yeah the other guy that's the that's the

he he looked like a like a frat bro

yeah when they first moved in and now

and now he's like some

hare krishna guy yeah haddock's other

complaint movie's so wacky yeah he's

like

he's a buddhist now with yeah basically

a harry krishna outfit and he's sitting

and playing like this

eight foot long sitar on a rug in the

middle of the room and he's driving

addicts crazy

and uh everyone walks in wearing like

equally obnoxiously bad

fake facial hair and laughs at this guy

playing the sitar in the middle of the

room

i hate all the mustaches and beards

moving forward for the whole rest of the

movie

they're so bad they're such bad fake

beards and mustaches time has passed how

else can we indicate

just grow a real beard it happens over

time

just grow the beard and then shoot it in

the order where you need the beard to

where you don't need the beard and shave

it down it was so strange when karen

allen had that beard yeah

what was his name leo

[Laughter]

yeah so they have that big fight but

then we immediately cut to

she's working in the warehouse right and

leo shows up like they're all still

like it's nothing yeah there's no

apology we don't see any of the calming

down we just see

this happened several times in the movie

where we just

jump cut to i guess time has passed and

we're cool with each other again

you know and it seems weird to me

because i feel like

most of the times the crap that he does

it's just like

yeah you know what she's dumped you and

moved on like there's no we're not

making up and this isn't getting better

like you keep doing crappy things and

she's just gonna dump you but no every

time she's just

cool with it yeah and and here uh she's

talking to

nick about her plans for this massive

art project

and she's going to be working in this

new studio and uh leo walks in and says

hey guys are you ready for our trip to

cape cod we're all going to cape cod so

who are you bringing

nick because you're not bringing my

girlfriend because that's my girlfriend

so you got to find a girlfriend he's

like oh you mean who did i ask about if

she wanted to come to cape cod with us

because i didn't know about that until

just this second when you told me that

we were going

and he said well you should bring

so-and-so and he's like i don't like her

he's like well then bring so and so and

we just cut to

him sitting in the back seat with shelly

long

and they're driving up to cape cod

leo and jess are

making out with each other in the

bathroom of their room

at this hotel or wherever they're

staying in cape cod or bed and breakfast

i don't know

and uh she uh she realizes she doesn't

have her diaphragm

she gets up and starts looking through

her luggage

and he's leo is furious he's just

shouting at her

and he's telling her that she should

take the pill and well we should mention

that he's

furiously masturbating well

i don't remember seeing him do that we

don't see it but then there was

the he's yelling at her the whole time

and he comes out with a towel and just

wiping his hands off

never mind they're all done it's like

wow nothing gets you off faster than

shouting at a woman

but yeah it seems like he just loses it

instantly somehow it's just like

how did you do that you were you were

literally yelling at me the whole time

that you were jerking it

no it was perfect that's why i hid your

diaphragm from you

yeah i have a lost diaphragm fetish

um but uh yeah uh she's never gonna find

it

oh god oh god i can't stop you have to

find it quick i'm gonna die of

dehydration

um

we're cutting this stuff this is the

trailer for this episode

um nick and jess hang art

i don't remember that happening but i

wrote it down here so yeah so

so um it comes the night of

the art that she's the art yeah um she

can't find leo so she has to do it

with nick right and they and shelly

along for some reason

i don't think she has a single line of

dialogue in the entire movie she does

barely i think she has she has a couple

lines later in the movie but up until

this point she hasn't said anything

she didn't say anything in cape cod yeah

she didn't say anything when they're

setting stuff up except like maybe old

man or something like that oh you're

right i think she tell she tells

um jessie that her like he's a crappy

guy

right yeah yeah it was like her only

life yeah like

like she's really proud of her moment

because well here's something coming to

ruin your day and it's leo yeah yeah

yeah

but yeah so they hang up this uh this

very like

her guernica inspired art piece which is

just you know a family holding up a kid

wearing a mickey mouse shirt standing on

a bunch of corpses like

the most easily thought of like

simplest possible protest art that

anyone could ever have come up with is

you know a white american family wearing

mickey mouse shirts standing on bodies

like that's just like the first thing

you would think of if you were trying to

come up with a cliche

art protest um and it's immediately

getting cut down

but uh everyone in the crowd is chanting

leave it up

like there was any chance of that

happening yeah on this well it appears

to be maybe a church

i thought it was a library i think it's

a school building okay of some sort it

was very is very cathedral-esque

yeah well it's supposed to be harvard

yes harvard

it is a church of information cathedral

of the mind

that's good that's better um

later at a a show that it seems like

jess wrote this show that she's putting

on

for like performance art and shelly long

is playing the leo character and they're

reenacting the

uh diaphragm incident and leo is just

shooting his load all over the audience

no

you can't hold it oh my god even when

they're pretending i can't

do it like i have to say i really love

shelly long's performance as leo yeah

it's funny

it was like she's doing great she's

she's awesome i like the little

spot of chess hair that they like glued

on her in her chest

um but she's being leo and she's just

saying you should just take the pill and

she's like well you know the pills are

really bad and it can cause cancer

and and uh they just cut to the next

scene where

they're the the tr the love triangle are

walking across the bridge

and uh leo is just chewing her out and

telling her that all of her friends are

like dumb lesbians and he can't stand

any of them

and which confused me i was like i was

like oh so shelly long is gay

but i thought that she was nick's date

yeah but i think

i think he was just trying to insult

angry and he's like okay oh you have

artsy friends they must all be gay then

because they made fun of me

if they're not interested in me sexually

they must be gay a bunch of idiots

um that sounds about right for this

character yeah

and uh and again nick stands to her

defense and is just like okay

you can calm down now there's no reason

for you to be freaking out on her it was

just

a show and chill out and then he gets in

the way he's like well you've been

trying to sleep with her ever since the

day you met

you probably just wish i was dead or

something like that and then nick

punches him in the face and just

is just like done walking away i don't i

don't need to deal with this

i don't need to deal with either one of

you if this is how it's going to go

every time

we cut back to the present for like

two sentences yeah and no reason at all

for jesse to like ruin the entire like

fantasy or like fiction of the story

to be like oh yeah oh a lot of stuff's

happened in my life i've been married

and been divorced now i'm working as an

attorney

and then we cut back to 1960s yeah so

it's like

why did that happen you just spoiled

that she doesn't marry either one of

these guys

and it's just like i didn't get the

point of it

yeah i i wrote wait when are we now oh

okay now i guess we're going back to

1969.

yeah like i was like what what is

happening with time

yeah i thought for a second that the

whole rest of the movie was going to be

in 1980. i feel like this entire

1980 stuff was shot after the fact maybe

like they didn't have oh you mean the

movie has no point and they were trying

to make it like

relevant or something i completely mean

that

well when we go back to the 60s uh for

one second we get an

example of nick's activism where he's

standing and reading the names of people

who were killed in the war

right that's nick is he is he one of

them

i don't i couldn't tell i don't know if

it was nick i thought

it was him standing on a pedestal rating

because he's

too busy with his doctor medical stuff

yeah

because when they cut back i thought it

was him i i thought it was him too but i

i think ultimately i don't think it was

the problem with the 60s is that

everybody looked the exact same

they all have shoulder length hair and

big fake mustaches glued on their heads

so funny you should mention their hair

so that

that that article that i sent you from

oh yeah

from it was so this was from uh

an mit newspaper from

may of uh 1979 called the tech

uh somebody wrote somebody wrote an

article about

having been this was written by sean

wilson and he

i guess he was an extra in uh in

in this movie because he talks about uh

you know doing this background work for

a small circle of friends and

he notes that they actually like bust

all these mit

students over and gave them all preppy

haircuts

in order to do this film uh and and he

also notes a couple other interesting

things in the article he says

that um you know they shot on a couple

different college campuses

mit uh wellesley emerson

and some others uh because the they were

asked to leave harvard because the of

the disruption

they were causing in quotes disruption

in quotes

so it's more than just that riot scene

that was the problem then

well or harvard was calling that riot

scene a disruption

but they they were never going to shoot

that on the on the harvard campus i

don't think

i don't know but they must have been

enough of a problem anyways we should

get to the riot scene

sure um a riot breaks out on campus

and uh this is shelley long's other bit

of dialogue she's a photographer yeah

in the midst of all this chaos and uh

leo is coaching her through

okay get all the pictures you can okay

get pictures of that get pictures of

this and she's taking all these pictures

he's like okay do you have enough

pictures

okay you have enough okay now run get

out of here oh yeah cause like

she because she she's starting to get a

little uneasy

right and i and i think that he's just

trying to say do you have what you need

because if you don't you need to stay

but if you do then there's no reason for

you to be here

yeah yeah um but uh leo sees

uh haddocks has been like beaten and

bloodied by the people trying to stomp

down this protest

and this is based on a real life event

that did happen in harvard square

there was a riot yeah um and leo

uh grabs haddocks and takes him to

not a hospital doctor which would make

sense also but nick

he takes good a rat doctor a rat doctor

who deals primarily with rats what is

what is he doing with the rats does

does he go into his experiments no he

just says that he's

working with him and then he's got one

named leo yeah because he never stops

he won't stop running yeah so he brings

that was supposed to be really deep it

probably was supposed to be

poor guys um but yeah so haddocks is

brought to

nick who fixes him up and then he's like

all right time to go

get beat up again and he's like how

about you don't do that and he takes

some time to not

succumb to a concussion and he says nah

nah i should i should be out there

protesting

and he leaves um so this might be the

beginning of his official like

hardcore mental illnesses he got kicked

in the head too many times here

but uh leo the next day they're

they're reading out the draft numbers

they have a lottery system

right um and the balls have birthdays on

them as they're pulling them out and if

your birthday comes up

they're going to pull out what 300

they're going to pull them off they'll

hold a year

yeah they do the whole year and they

said the first like 125 are basically

guaranteed to go

correct and he's third yeah he's the

third name

drawing um yeah his birthday is december

30th

and uh so we find out i feel like it

would have been more interesting if we'd

seen earlier

that his birthday was december 30th but

have it be like oh you know it's the

last day of the year and it's like oh it

was your birthday yesterday like

some so that we as the audience knew

that well that would involve

shooting scenes in this movie that

actually set up to have a payoff later

that's true which we don't do

we set up scenes that have zero payoff

yeah

so he loses it because he got he's

basically the third birthday that's

gonna get shipped out

and he's terrified of dying in vietnam

because he has all these

grandiose plans for how he's gonna live

his life here in america

but he also refuses to

pretend that he's not physically fit

enough to serve yeah he refuses to go to

canada

he's like canada he like just he's

terrified of going to vietnam but he's

even more terrified of draft dodging

which doesn't seem like leo at all

yeah it seems like this character would

just be a revolutionary from canada for

the rest of the movie

right right he like that's what it seems

like he's he's a revolutionary in every

other sense around campus

except you're not gonna you know draft

dodge

yeah okay yeah we have presidents cool

enough to draft dodge

and you're going to stick around here

right

it's a weird way to put it i guess that

is a weird way to put it can i give them

some bone spurs is there someone we can

inject bone spurs into leo

um but yeah it does for some reason

later he draft dodges anyway

but here he's acting like well obviously

i can't do that i guess i have to go

unless they find a reason i shouldn't be

there

but can you forge the documents and get

me out of it because i'm too chicken to

go to canada it's so far away

he doesn't ask for it though no but he

accepts it when they give it to him well

and and

and he is relying on nick nick keeps

saying we're gonna figure it out

we're gonna figure something out yep yes

you will nick

yeah solve all of my problems nick

and cause more problems for hacks

haddocks finds out that he

that leo is you know freaking out and

not leaving his apartment and just

drawing up all the statistics for how

many people are dying every year in

vietnam

and he invites him to the underground uh

he wants to

get get him off the grid into haddock's

land

and uh leo basically turns him down

doesn't really respond but basically

turns him down nick says

hey we should take jess out it's her

birthday and uh

leo says ah i'm pretty messed up right

now i don't think i can do it why don't

you take her out you guys have a good

time

and so he does and of course they have

sex because

leo's not around for five seconds

finally and

uh everything uh everything goes

according to

both of their plans probably nick

decides that he's going to go back home

and fake all these medical records to

get leo out of the draft

and there's like a whole thing where he

comes home and he's like mother

and i was like ooh is mother dead does

something bad happen to the mother

was dead for two years and he never

called well yeah cause like he's never

checked up on her but i guess no she's

just

not home yeah uh but she might have

objected to him

uh forging medical documents in his

father's name

yeah ruining their legacy but

it seems like that's the point is that

it's like well i can still be a doctor

as long as my dad's the one who did this

illegal thing so i'm gonna do it on all

of his letterheads

and make it look like he had it that leo

had a childhood history of

well i mean that i mean that's what it

was it's like it had to have happened

since he was 12 years old

so obviously he has to be a doctor that

could have treated him but also

if it were found out he wouldn't be

incriminating anyone alive

because they'd just be like oh this is

fake and it's like oh well go arrest my

dad i'll just tell you where his plot is

uh i think nick could be accused of this

crime right they would have to prove

that though

but his name probably isn't on this

paper his first name anyway

this is where the music starts to

blatantly be just uh total eclipse of

the heart for the whole rest of the

movie

just different sections of the song they

rush to the base where

they're doing the physicals on all of

the people getting drafted

uh including daniel stern yeah whose uh

strategy is to just pretend he's crazy

because that used to get people out of

service

but apparently that's not the case

anymore um but

they're unable to get these forged

documents into leo's hands

before they get him into the building

and so

jesse decides she's going to call in a

bomb threat from a pay phone on the base

which i feel like would get tracked

pretty quickly i don't know well i mean

yeah i guess they could trace calls but

probably not as efficiently as they

could today

i just thought because it was a landline

and because it was from the actual base

that it would show up somewhere that

that's

that person's calling from here it was

1980.

well it was 19.

either way she calls in a bomb threat

which i also feel like

in addition to potentially being

traceable would be a thing that would

happen

a lot for people that are trying to get

their loved ones out of the service um

but they take it seriously enough that

they

tell everyone to get out of the building

even though they're all in their

underwear

um and uh as leo's coming out nick runs

up and hands them all the paperwork

and he says hey this is gonna get you

out of service

so use it also also

uh jess is my girlfriend now and she's

going to stay my girlfriend

so if you want to hang out with us

that's cool but

um i'm trading you your life for your

girlfriend

basically oh it was a tradesies i get it

tradesies

and like like i thought for a moment he

was considering just going to vietnam

that's what i thought that was gonna be

like

 i'm just gonna go yeah i thought he

was gonna take the

thing and be like no deal

but yeah so uh the next day leo shows up

at their house pretending to be blind

again well this is the next day this is

years later years later when he comes

back from vietnam

that was 1971. he didn't go to vietnam

did he

no he he turned around like he was going

to walk back in

and then came to his senses and then

just left and that's and then it goes

then it fades out and fades back in in

1971. yeah

um so it's maybe it's taken him a couple

years to forgive them

for caring about each other i guess um

and uh he knocks on the door

with a can and pretends like he's blind

because remember it's like when we met

disabilities

and uh and i was faking a disability

just like i did to get out of service

right now

shouldn't he have then just just pushed

a naked girl into

a girl into the house should that have

been more when they first met yeah

it's a better actually the first time

they met was through a door where he was

just saying do you want a beer

you're right that's not a call back

because nobody else was there

like is nick in that first scene when he

pretended

oh but they don't know each other yeah

right right but i just think that's

really funny if you're

if you're referencing something that we

didn't experience together

like get it didn't you hear when all the

people applauded me when i did that yeah

i heard you said that everyone applauded

you i don't believe that for a second

not a believable thing that would happen

um

they have a weird third wheel vacation

no

they have an intended third wheel

vacation because it moves into a

threesome

yeah but it's did i zone out during the

threesome they have a threesome

do they yeah i don't remember a

threesome

did we watch an edited version of this

film so

they have like the crazy like day where

they're running around eating lobster

and then they're going to bed for the

night and hold on we're going we're

skipping over something important here

on the way to the threesome

which is this dinner scene where

infuriating

they probably spent hours cooking all

this food and then they just smear it

all into one like

mount like it's a devil's peak pile in

their plate yeah and they're like

here's your here's your lobster madame

here's your potatoes my damn here's a

whole

stick of butter standing upright my damn

here's your sour cream my damn here's

your tribes madame

and poor karen allen is trying to

pretend this is funny and that she finds

it amusing

and her forced laughter is painful in

this scene because it's just like

ugh i'm sorry that the director made you

guys act out this whole

nonsense scene corn for madonna

mashed potatoes from my damn

butter for my dumb sour cream format

but yeah after after that they something

happens you're saying

yeah so they go upstairs for the night

and

she passionately kisses nick and then

passionately kisses leo

and then she goes into the room into the

dark like the door's open and she just

goes into the room disappears in the

darkness and nick

gestures for leo to enter first and leo

goes in and then nick goes in right

behind him and the door closes

dude i totally missed this attack i did

too and i've watched it twice now

and then like the next scene is them

talking on the bed they're talking about

going to europe

but i think it's pretty obvious

yeah if that if that is what actually

happened then yes i think you're right

richard

this movie just keeps daring me to look

away

so i missed the whole moment

you win this round movie um

stop paying attention patrick stop

paying attention something interesting

is about to happen

um but yeah so the three of them

basically live together now and they see

a new story

about some bombings that are going on

and they play a recording of

the person that's making these bomb

threats and actually taking action with

bombs and

it's clearly to them haddock's voice

right and leo's like

okay this is a problem we got to get

haddocks out of whatever he's

leading yeah but leo is still pretending

like he's a victim here and that he got

sucked into something beyond his control

and it's like no no he's the manson here

but um but he decides that okay well

what is the only way i can contact

haddocks

well we've established very well that

harry the guy who runs the bookstore

is very good friends with haddocks and

probably has a connection to oh wait no

we've never seen

people in the same scene but he is a

psychic but he is psychic

he knows about drugs and computers so he

must know how to get to haddocks

so he just happens to know and uh they

blindfold leo

and put him in the back of a like

blacked-out van

and drive him to this farmhouse where uh

where haddocks is like you know he's got

a a whole cult of people wearing purge

masks yeah

just going about their day trying to

assemble bombs with

very cumbersome masks on yeah well so

like are they wearing these masks so

they know that leo's coming or

do they always just all wear masks i

think it's because they know leo is

coming but they

do they all have masks yeah all over the

steps

but that's what i'm saying but i mean

like before they knew that leo was

coming do they all already have masks or

did they go to

a walmart and buy like seven assorted

masks

i think they probably have masks to do

their army of the 12 monkeys

project mayhem style actions but uh

yeah so i would say they probably had

masks okay well haddock is walking him

through the house

they go down into the basement and he

sees people assembling very sloppily

assembling

sticks of dynamite into like time bombs

essentially

or like unabomber style boxes that will

explode when they're opened

and uh the two of them sort of retreat

to the kitchen table

where leo you know does this last ditch

effort of like

he he's like these people are crazy you

need to get out of here these people are

insane he's like

i am these people i i'm a part of this

like you you can't separate me from them

and he says look maybe it's time to put

the hate away

and just get on with your life and start

to accept

how the world works and haddocks

basically says

like well what about your article are

you gonna just walk away from that and

he said yes i'll walk away from the

article if you come with me right now

and you leave this place and you don't

ever come back and he basically just

kind of laughs it off at leo and offers

him a cookie yeah and then the building

explodes

yeah this this took me a little bit by

surprise yeah i was

very much not expecting this moment i

did expect this building to explode

eventually i didn't think it would

explode

right here in this scene yeah well

especially because we did like this

little

jump scare earlier when they're making

the bombs where like

the timer goes off and then the gag is

that they were making

hard-boiled eggs downstairs and so it

wasn't the clock that they were making

the bombs with it was

you know his egg timer uh you know and

and so it scared leo

rightfully so because then he blows up

yeah

but yeah the whole building explodes and

then we cut back to

the house that jess and nick are living

in and

jess is leaving nick because leo died

yeah she's so sad that she's gonna leave

the only person

that she could share the memory of leah

with she's

so sad that the jerk that's been a jerk

his whole life to her

is dead yeah i there's there's no reason

that this scene would play out like this

and it's just a dumb excuse for

explaining why

a perfect guy who has done nothing wrong

the whole time would break up with a

perfect girl who has done nothing wrong

the whole right

they're like what's a good like

blameless reason for these two to

separate and they're like

there isn't one what if leo died

i get why would she leave though what if

she did people do weird things after

their friends explode yeah

but also like

this house explodes i had a hard time

piecing this together in the sense that

the house explodes

they obviously find bodies or remnants

of bodies and it's very clear that this

was a terrorist organization building

bombs right

amongst them is leo

and they're going to have to try to

convince the police or the fbi that leah

was not a part of this

when he clearly has this track record of

civil disobedience

and causing trouble but he also has a

journalism track record and he has

character witnesses like

harry who put him in touch with haddocks

that could say he was going to write a

story about him he came to me and asked

for

also who cares i mean like yeah

are they really trying to clear leo's

name well they're gonna put leo's corpse

in jail

well i just i just thought it was

curious that it was never brought up

like there was never a question about

well no that would have been

interesting that's true and we don't

want to do that

you're forgetting rule number one circle

of friends

you mean you mean a small line segment

of friends right yes and at this point

we've

slowly brought it down another another

point

well she takes a bunch of leo's things

to his father

yes which is mostly just clothes it's

like really nothing yeah this is great

thanks i'm going to fit in my son's

clothes

so meaningful and there's a suitcase of

old crap i'm going to drop them off at

goodwill how about how about his

typewriter or that hat he was wearing

that really nice hat with the like

pencil in it like he was a journalist

yeah it's like you're already sad and

you're at work do you want to smell your

son

here's a box of his garbage thanks

there's a diaphragm in there somewhere i

can't find it

and that dad's like

in the present again for no reason nick

explains i'm a psychiatrist and she's

like oh that's perfect

for some reason i'm not clear why you

haven't done anything

psychiatric uh your character was

completely underwritten

in this whole movie leonardo da vinci is

the only character in this movie

no one else does anything interesting

the only character and he's completely

unlikable the entire time yeah

um nick chases her cab again because

she's

about to leave in it and how mad is this

cab driver first first

he gets into a car accident with this

guy yeah then he has

a same driver he has to wait for them to

have this conversation stood there for

an hour and 45 minutes talking about the

60s

and now he hits my cam again yeah

he's like do you guys really need to say

this to each other didn't weren't you

both there

why are you telling this whole story to

each other

yeah this is the information you already

and some of these scenes like you're not

both there

okay whatever um the cam driver's like

you weren't even there how would you end

up even known about that how do you know

what leo was doing in the room before

either of you met him

none of these were flashbacks no he

wasn't recounting this yeah

but maybe that's okay leo's the cab

driver

oh the toy was gonna say like no that's

great that's why that explains why he

got in the bar fight they don't know why

because he's the ghost of christmas past

no because neither of them

were there for that and but then i

remembered oh leo did have i was

thinking wait a minute does this movie

like actually really great because

there are no scenes where neither one's

one yeah like like

they they there are no scenes with with

them without leo

so when leo's away on his own we don't

know what he's doing unless there's

other

witnesses there to tell us the story uh

but then there was the final scene where

he blows up so it

takes the whole thing away that's true

i'm going to make it this movie missed

once again

i'm going to make a reindeer of this

movie where it makes it

so and it's just them hearing that the

house exploded

yeah that's significantly less

interesting than an already dull movie

um but yeah that's the end of the film

is uh that he gets in the cab with her

and it seems like this is a direct

graduate reference that we're seeing

them

yeah through the back window of the cab

sitting next to each other which is like

the same as how the graduate ends with

them sitting in the back of the bus

but they don't end with them as a

caricature drawing yeah they turn into

an illustration here for some reason we

also start the film with them

illustrated in the form of the poster

that yeah it felt like they just paid a

bunch of money to make somebody

like do a drawing of them like we gotta

use this repeatedly

this looks just like them well i just

traced friends from the movie

uh the director here rob cohen this was

his first uh

feature film was it his last no he went

on to do dragon heart

the skulls and the first fast and the

furious film

really yes and also xxx no kidding

um and he just did a hurricane heist

last year

i don't know what that is i saw that

it's i only know it from how did this

get made

okay so so his training was maintained

um the writer uh was ezra sax who also

wrote

wild cats which when i was like oh

wildcats that's the one with kurt

russell and

it's like no that's that's best of times

yeah but i always confuse those movies

because they're husband and wife

or they're not husband and wife but

they're they're a couple uh

yeah because goldie hawn yeah goldie

hawn and kurt russell

um but for this this whole time i've

thought that best of times was wildcats

that they were the same movie

i was like oh no this is not what i

remember at all brad davis plays

leonardo da vinci rizzo but he drops the

rizzo

um he played billy hayes in midnight

express

and uh jackson schultz in chariots of

fire

he's one of many people who goes on to

play himself in the player

for rower altman and he actually died of

aids

at 41 11 years after this film came out

karen allen was jessica bloom she was

katie an animal house before this

um she would later be jenny hayden in

starman

or was that before this too i i think

starman was 84.

okay so that's later next year she'll be

marrying ravenwood and raiders

yeah um it's too bad they never got her

back maybe she'll be in that fourth

indiana jones movie that they're working

on now

supposed to come out soon but who knows

um

claire and scrooge that's a classic

jameson parker was nick baxter which

it's it honestly seems like he should

have been in more movies but

there really wasn't a lot on his imdb

that he recognized it seems he's best

known for simon and simon

yeah because he was him and gerald

mcraney yeah

but um yeah he didn't do a lot of other

big movies

um shelly long was alice she obviously

went on to be diane chambers and cheers

um and a crowley in the money pit um

she's basically like

the katherine heigl of the 80s yeah uh

yeah

we can't we can't not mention troop

beverly hills right yes in which

she is glorious yeah i like this analogy

she she walked away from a lot of jobs

that were very kind to her

and uh her career suffered as a result

of it it seems like

gary springer was green blatt he plays

andy and jaws too

he's stevie and dog day afternoon and

this was his last film but he

is still around um i'm not sure why he

stopped acting after this

um daniel stern was the crazy kid people

obviously know him as uh

as the home alone character or the

narrator of the wonder years which i

think is supposed to be the adult voice

of the

fred savage character right yeah yeah

and city slickers

uh apparently he's the voice of dilbert

which i didn't realize until i was

looking it up

that makes sense um another movie i

really like from him is very bad things

with christians later

i i can't watch that movie anymore it's

so good it's

really upsetting but have you seen that

i haven't seen that

but you know what a big christian slater

fan i am yeah will i be after i watch

this movie oh it's good

okay i like it a lot uh the cast is

incredible

yeah um and uh cameron diaz is in it

she's amazing

um jeremy piven is in it he's amazing

like everybody's really really good

sounds good

it's probably one of my favorite things

from all of those people

and daniel stern was also ben savage's

father

in little monsters so he worked with

both of the savage bros

as they're called in there in their uh

porn films

well that's not a thing i just made that

up um david hollander

played the editor of the crimson in this

movie and was at the actual editor of

the crimson during the events of the

film

yeah i thought that was pretty

interesting yeah

but um it's all my factoids jess what do

you think up or down on this one

oh it's a big down yeah uh

nothing that's a no it's a pass yeah an

open out on this also

letterboxed oh gosh

do you want to start jess yeah it's

going pretty far down there let me

um let me look at this list here i think

it goes at the bottom

really wow maybe ah so hard wow

okay i actually liked

what's on the bottom of your list now

caligula

but like i so i actually like and you

know how much i didn't like this movie

i actually like just tell me what you

want more than this movie

i'm actually 100 with you i'm putting it

right under just

i think i'm putting it right under the

problem is that it's so different than

caligula

that i don't i i dislike them each for

very different reasons sure so i'm

struggling with what the actual bottom

is

yeah and i don't know if it i don't know

which

which side of caligula to put this on uh

i don't know ah you do making me pick

it's like a sophie's choice but it's the

other way around shitty movies

which kid do i want to give away

[Laughter]

richard what are you doing yeah uh well

i'm actually putting it up

a little higher at the bottom a little

higher at the bottom

yeah still the bottom on my list but

higher because well because once once

you get

past and calling it the windows

threshold

uh everything out of the sill everything

after that is just like

burn it yeah yes um

but uh yeah so it's going to be just

below

windows okay windows this is a burner

oh my god i 100 agree with you in the

windows threshold of the 1980s

yeah that is hilarious that's windows is

just as much as i can tolerate

honestly i only have two in my burn it

category

with the windows threshold uh no with

the windows threshold there i have four

movies below windows but i wouldn't i

wouldn't burn anything until fatso

so so where is yours just under just

tell me what you want

all right i think i think mine i think

maybe i'll put it between caligula and

just tell me what you want

okay all right that sounds good

i think that's about everything for this

one um if you guys have any thoughts

you'd like to share with us we are

vintagevideopod on twitter facebook

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where as we've said multiple times you

can find each of our full movie rankings

for the year

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vintagevideopodcast.com

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vintagevideopodcast thank you so much

for listening and i hope you will join

us next time when we'll be discussing

defiance which according to imdb is

about the following

tommy takes up temporary housing in a

new york city neighborhood

plagued by a violent gang called the

souls

we're leaving now with the trailer for

defiance

[Music]

he was a stranger

he was a loner i'm just passing through

am i my own business this concerns you

too

no it doesn't he wanted no part of their

world

i think this is what i want this rat

trap you live in just think about this

they're gonna be able to take your whole

stupid life and stick it in that duffel

bag yours

he wanted no part of their problem

used to be a nice place to live in right

here just neighborhood

all of a sudden it's changed

so

but he became part of their world

[Music]

and their problems became his

[Music]

finish big man he did

the more he tried to leave the more he

knew he had to stay

hey

[Music]

oh

they all lived in fear

all but one hey tough guy

before your girlfriends can cross the

street i'm gonna bend this six-pack

around your head

but don't mess with me punk

clown cut me until he tossed them

defiance

[Applause]

chad michael vincent teresa saldana

and academy award winner art carney

defiance from american international

you